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<title>Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas : Responses</title>
<description>Design Observer ::Â Join the Discussion</description>
<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/</link>
<dc:language>en-us</dc:language>
<dc:creator>Design Observer Group</dc:creator>
<dc:date>2013-04-11T12:54:27-05:00</dc:date>
<copyright>http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/1.0</copyright>




<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[Daniel, I'm going to ask them, and I'll try to report back! It's a good -- provocative -- question. I am tending to de-emphasize categorization at the moment (I have cross-disciplinary students) and ask students instead what problems particular designs solve, how, and in whose interests. <br />
<br />
Interesting new piece here: <br />
<br />
http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2013-04-04/apples-campus-2-shapes-up-as-an-investor-relations-nightmare<br />
<br />
"... in Silicon Valley, nothing says youâve peaked quite like a lavish new HQ" ]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-04-11T12:54:27-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[Thanks, Simon.<br />
<br />
Another question for your students, then: Is Apple's new headquarters an example of industrial design, or architecture, or both?<br />
<br />
Daniel Gregory<br />
<br />
]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-26T18:53:45-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[Thank you everyone for taking the time to read my post and provide thoughtful comments. <br />
<br />
The Light & Space connection is a good one and is also made by Alex Kitnick ("Phenomenal: California Light, Space, Surface," Artforum, February 1, 2012). It's remiss of me not to have included it since it came up in conversation at a seminar convened by Sylvia Lavin in preparation for the MAK Center show "Everything Loose Will Land" (http://www.mak.at/en/program/event?article_id=1350932582333&event_id=1350932582350) -- which I mention here since the show is likely to be of interest to any readers drawn to things Californian. <br />
<br />
I'm not sure that my arguments in this piece would have been changed by a more detailed comparison with Koolhaas, though I regret that readers might be left feeling short-changed in that respect. Maybe I'll return to it some time. <br />
<br />
Finally, the question of questions, raised by dgregory and taken up by Aaron Betsky -- "what would a modernist carrier with criticality or catalytic function be?" I truly fear depressing my students as we circle this issue. Yet students can perceive an aesthetic or intellectual or social "surplus" even in the most sober analyses of design history. It's as producers of those surpluses that Koolhaas and Jobs are so helpful to me in the classroom, other reservations aside.]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-22T20:33:26-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[He really did have some amazing ideas!]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-21T14:49:29-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[The glass cube is only part of the store experience. When you go down inside, the minimalism is quickly replaced by wood tables, scores of people, backlight colorful photos, bright lights, products and more. The architecture is meant to disappear in face of the real "art" like the Louve you show. Which is different then true zen, which would be a room with nothing at all. <br />
Koolhaas on the otherhand is more in the architectural tradition of creating one-of-a-kind spaces. They are as far from a "brand" as you could say---i see little similarlity between Koolhaas projects. I've heard them described as Hyperrational, which means they are rational to their particular site and context--though there are stylistic similarities, whereas Apple makes modernist Starbucks meant to be familiar across countries. ]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-21T00:23:50-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[Minor note, footnote 29 incorrectly references Critical Inquiry no. 37, it is vol 38, No. 1,  Autumn 2011 in case you are looking for it.
<br/><br/>
<strong>Thank you. We've made this correction. â Eds.</strong>]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-20T11:30:56-05:00</dc:date>
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<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[Yes, Droog! I agree.]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-19T16:29:59-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[Ah, that is the question, isn't it?  Buildings have a hard enough time being at all critical, and perhaps cannot be, but consumer objects?  I would argue that the Droog people figured it out to a certain extent, as did the Castigliones at one point, but then again, those are fairly limited production.  I don not know the answer, but would love to.  ]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-19T16:24:13-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[Aaron, acute and lucid as always...I had to look up the Light & Space Movement. But what would a modernist carrier with criticality or catalytic function be? Can it be a consumer object at all? ]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-19T15:53:34-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[This is quite a ride indeed.  I do love the notion of "Zen kitsch" as defining Apple.  It is part of the same aesthetic that makes W Hotels and Zara into the current carriers of the modernist meme, but without any of the criticality or catalytic function that the notion of representing modernity could and I think should have.<br />
<br />
I also think it is important to embed that aesthetic in California culture, though I do think you, if I may say so, got it a bit wrong: it is not the Bay Area School of woodsy modernism, but the Light & Space movement that is the real percursor.  If there are roots in Eichler, it is in the blanding-down of high modernism, again the notion of default modernism withut criticality.  I also think the analysis of OMA is very, very superficial; the title promises a much more thorough analysis of both Jobs' and Koolhaas' conceptual turn away from singular products and towards catalytic interventions and the desire for mass consumption.  The one point of intersection is the notion of whether there is an absolutism about this kind of large-scale capitalism and how you become complicit with it, no matter how either Zen or critical you are.]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-19T14:35:53-05:00</dc:date>
</item>
<item>
	<title><![CDATA[Responding to "Steve Jobs versus Rem Koolhaas"]]></title>
	<description><![CDATA[This is a wide ranging and complex post (though I am admittedly a little slow and impatient), but I think you have hit on a key point about Bay Region architecture in the time of William Wurster and Joseph Esherick, and that is their celebration of the ordinary -- as with a material like plywood, which Wurster used because it looked cheaper but was in fact more expensive than other choices. <br />
<br />
I can see a relationship to the Jobs esthetic as a kind of reversal of that approach -- making the highly designed object -- Mac, iphone etc., etc.  -- ordinary. And also to a Miesian esthetic where the material is the ornament, itself a comment on Adolf Loos. <br />
<br />
But what about the new Apple headquarters as architecture? A beautiful object to be sure -- to me it is the apotheosis of the gadget -- but perhaps a very old-fashioned and wasteful approach to land-use, building, and urban design. And that would seem to contradict the very notion of esthetic efficiency lying at the heart of so many wonderful Apple products.]]></description>
	<author></author>
	<link>http://places.designobserver.com/feature/steve-jobs-versus-rem-koolhaas/37722/#comments</link>
	<dc:date>2013-03-19T12:47:48-05:00</dc:date>
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